Raphael,You make a very valid point (as usual!). However,
where bamboo seeks to compete head to head with a
specific wood product (particle board or plywood
for example) independent, academic studies are
essential and I believe the absence of these
studies will limit bamboo's growth (pun
intended). A customer needs to know how a bamboo
product compares with it's wood equivalent before
purchasing, especially if the bamboo product is
more expensive. He simply will not buy unless he
knows the M of E or the results of screw pull
tests. Unless bamboo does the minimum job
intended - and is proven to do so - all the
"sound advantages of bamboo" will not matter.
Richard
At 07:46 AM 11/17/2008, you wrote:
>Dear Jehan,
>
>the problem is that there is no possible way of having a precise scientific
>evaluation system of the social-economic-cultural and environmental impact
>of every product from every nation. Comparing bamboo to wood, is like
>comparing bananas to apples.
>
>Let´s just be reasonable and advocate the sound advantages of bamboo, not
>try to force misleading environmental propaganda on bamboo unreal
>advantages, and hope that our efforts and conclusions are in the path of
>truth. It is impossible to be perfect in this world, not one single product
>is trully sustainable if replicated by 6 billion people.
>
>In my opinion, bamboo people should be discrete using environmental
>marketing over its products, as means of green factor comparition are badly
>developed. Priority seems to be changing people´s old habits before trying
>to "greenicize" all economy at once.
>
>best wishes,
>
>Raphael Moras de Vasconcellos
><mailto:raphael%40bambubrasileiro.com>raphael@bambubrasileiro.com
>/ www.bambubrasileiro.com
><mailto:raphael%40agenciabambu.com.br>raphael@agenciabambu.com.br
>/ www.agenciabambu.com.br
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From:
><mailto:bamboo-plantations%40yahoogroups.com>bamboo-plantations@yahoogroups.com
>[mailto:bamboo-plantations@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jehan de Maille
>Sent: sexta-feira, 7 de novembro de 2008 23:11
>To:
><mailto:bamboo-plantations%40yahoogroups.com>bamboo-plantations@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [bamboo-plantations] Re: Bamboo facts on floors and furniture!
>
>[Note from a Moderator ... with no intention of discouraging comment on the
>vital topic of sustainability, members are reminded that all posts to BP
>must be related to bamboo ... Geoff Kyle.]
>
>maybe a simple solution lies into classifying green products on their degree
>of "green commitment"
>
>5 stars would be your most efficiently sustainable product and so on....
>
>This will come up one day, as we see now some products in supermarket stands
>with their "carbon weight" from production process to the stand shown on the
>label........
>
>Jehan de Maille
>
>Costalegre, Jalisco, Mexico
>
>Cel: +52 (1/045/044) 315 1002113
>Skype: Jahnot
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Xavier Dufrénot
>To:
><mailto:bamboo-plantations%40yahoogroups.com>bamboo-plantations@yahoogroups.com
>Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2008 8:21 PM
>Subject: Re: [bamboo-plantations] Re: Bamboo facts on floors and
>furniture!
>
>Dear Raphael,
>
>Your question is very interesting on a ethical and political point of
>view. What is the level of acceptance to define a green or not green
>product, sustainable or not sustainable? The question of sustainability has
>maked a lof of sociologists busy without clear answer up to now, simply
>because they get stuck on many questions like: can we consider any kind of
>classic way of productivity as sustainable just because they make green
>products? can we consider that a green product is sustainable if during its
>production is not (socialy and economicaly) ? Can we have a sustainable
>development without changing our way of production and consumption? Can we
>define sustainability without rule and clear regulation that can be
>followed by everyone from all over the world? I am still working on it.
>Bamboo is the best case study for all these questions!
>
>Xavier
>
>--- On Tue, 11/4/08, Jehan de Maille
><<mailto:jehan.de.maille%40gmail.com>jehan.de.maille@gmail.com> wrote:
>From: Jehan de Maille
><<mailto:jehan.de.maille%40gmail.com>jehan.de.maille@gmail.com>
>Subject: Re: [bamboo-plantations] Re: Bamboo facts on floors and
>furniture!
>To:
><mailto:bamboo-plantations%40yahoogroups.com>bamboo-plantations@yahoogroups.com
>Date: Tuesday, November 4, 2008, 5:45 PM
>
>i think the solution is to be found in this same forum.....look how many
>projects of nurseries and/or plantations are announced per week worldwide...
>.
>
>...if people in southern europe and northern africa start producing (Spain
>subsidies bamboo production), then bamboo flooring there could get more S.
>
>....now of course eskimos will have to stick to ice flooring if they want
>to go "green".....
>
>of course no one is going to point a gun on someone's head forcing them to
>buy this more expensive flooring for its eco figures..... .
>
>.....but look around and judge for yourself.... ..
>
>----- Original Message -----
>
>From: Raphael Moras de Vasconcellos
>
>To: bamboo-plantations@ yahoogroups. com
>
>Sent: Tuesday, November 04, 2008 8:39 AM
>
>Subject: Re: [bamboo-plantations ] Re: Bamboo facts on floors and
>furniture!
>
>Dear Kinder,
>
>I am too always skeptic about the usage of the S word regarding this IS OR
>
>IS NOT sustainable for bamboo products. It is not 100% right neither to
>call
>
>bamboo flooring sustainable or unsustainable. Glue, machinery, energy,
>
>transportation, etc are all factors. There are advantages and
>disadvantages.
>
>A simple question: how could North America and Europe produce local 100%
>
>sustainable flooring??? Possible?
>
>Another one: could people just stop buying not 100% sustainable flooring?
>
>Sometimes arguments tend to be eco-exagerated. But sure, we must adress
>
>problems and find alternative solutions ASAP.
>
>best wishes,
>
>Raphael Moras de Vasconcellos
>
>raphael@bambubrasil eiro.com / www.bambubrasileiro .com
>
>raphael@agenciabamb u.com.br / www.agenciabambu. com.br
>
>-----Original Message-----
>
>From: bamboo-plantations@ yahoogroups. com
>
>[mailto:bamboo-plantations@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Txbooguru@aol.
>com
>
>Sent: segunda-feira, 3 de novembro de 2008 01:30
>
>To: bamboo-plantations@ yahoogroups. com
>
>Subject: {SPAM} Re: [bamboo-plantations ] Re: Bamboo facts on floors and
>
>furniture!
>
>of it being a sustainable material we want to use it for everything, but
>we
>
>dont realize that some process affect it and damage some of the
>sustainable
>
>characteristics that it originaly has.
>
>Can someone please 'define' the word "sustainable" for me in regards to
>
>PRODUCTS.
>
>In MY mind, the word "Sustainable' , is regards to our ability to keep it
>
>growing and producting:: i.e. NOT using it to the point of extinction..
>
>In THAT context the word has NOTHING to do with HOW we USE it.. I
>
>have
>
>recently seen, PhD Thesis, written about the "sustainability" of bamboo
>
>PRODUCTS. To ME that word does NOT fit.
>
>Or is that another menaing that I am not aware of ? ? ? We can "sustain"
>
>the production of Bamboo flooring (for example), as long as there is
>bamboo
>
>to do it with. But if proper maintainence and harvesting techniques are
>
>not
>
>used, then the groves of Bamboo will NOT be sustainable. (Did that
>
>make sense ??? )
>
>Best regards to all Bambooers. Kinder in Central TExas.
>
>************ **Plan your next getaway with AOL Travel. Check out Today's
>Hot
>
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>
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>
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>travel?ncid= emlcntustrav0000 0001)
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
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>
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>
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